dynamo removal

[nth]

I'm nearing the end of the mechanical restoration of my 33 nine sports having had the block crack mended, reinstalled with new clutch and rebuilt the brakes etc. etc.
Finally have the engine running nicely with good oil pressure and find that there is no charge.
She's been rewired over 30 years ago to have a voltage regulator and two wire connecting dynamo. Can't see a number.
I need to get this out for service but cannot see how.

It was off for the block crack repair but that was by removing the distributor etc and taking out the entire drive through to the fan pulley (not me!)
Can the dynamo be remove independently?

Thanks
Neil

[Phillip]

Hey Neil,

If your car is a 1933 Nine Sports with the E-48-A 'slim' dynamo, it should look like this:

1933 Lucas E-48A Dynamo.jpg (261.69 KiB) Viewed 3274 times

This dynamo has the field fuse and half-charge on the back, rather than on the cut-out and fuse box.

If this is the dynamo you have, you also have the 'short' distributor / dynamo drive casting.

The drive system will look like this:

1933 Lucas Dynamo Drive_972 Nine.jpg (243.72 KiB) Viewed 3274 times

Three pins (not shown) go into the holes in the back of the distributor / dynamo driveshaft and these pins match up to the three holes in a fibre ring on the dynamo end shaft. In late 1933 the electrical system was upgraded and a larger dynamo fitted, with a longer, bigger, drive housing. The cutout and fuse box also changed.

Three types of drive were used on the 972 engine between 1933 and 1937; the pin type; four tooth steel gears with a rubber ring in between and four tooth splined steel gears with a splined steel slip ring.

The dynamo is help in place by two upper bolts, which lock the dynamo assembly in place and permit the drive chain to be tensioned, and a long stud at the bottom which the dynamo assembly pivots on for the chain tension. You should be able to pull the dynamo off without disturbing the rest, if there is clearance, but getting it back together with the pin drive may be a bit problematic!

These are all three brush charging systems and need to be modified if running as a two brush with more modern post-war style voltage regulators.

Hope that helps!

[Phillip]

Here's a comparison of the 1934-on large drive housing (L) compared to the 1933 small type (R).

dynamo drive housings_Large and Small.jpg (274.47 KiB) Viewed 3271 times

You can just see the spine type drive with the steel ring on the large unit and the pin drive on the small one.

Both units are from Sports/LM engines as they have the tachometer drive take-off at the bottom of the distributor shaft. A great point for oil leaks, especially through the drive cable!

[nth]

Thanks Plillip
Mines a bit of a mess at present as the previous owner didn't finish the work before abandoning the car. I got it 30 odd years later!
Hopefully the image will show.
The two wires left poking out are both reading earth.
When the engine is running there is an odd flick on the ammeter and only very intermittent voltage shown on the test meter.

Looks like removal time!
Thanks again
Neil

[nth]

For further info, she's a 1933 (34 model year) nine sports four seat factory fitted le-mans engine and CGC box.
Fitted voltage regulator an appears two wire dynamo.

[Phillip]

Hey Neil,

My pleasure to help!

Very useful shot! This is indeed the later type. Your dynamo drive is probably the type with the four tooth gears and rubber 'cushion' ring...but who knows what has been fitted after all these years. I am going to guess your car has the long front wings, not the 'helmet' type. The CGC is a nice extra and was also on my car when new, but, sadly has been lost in time. It's a '34 Sports also, registered in late '33 in the Isle of Wight.

If the wiring is dodgy you could always go for a new Autosparks harness that is the correct spec with 'cloth covered' (now rayon) wires in the correct Lucas colours, braided into the correct style loom. I don't see the junction box that is usually mounted on the upper/outer bolt of the dynamo flange. Do you still have the Lucas SLC-2 control switch at the bottom of the steering column?

There is a company in the UK that will rebuild your dynamo and match it to your cutout by converting the internals to proper two brush and the cutout to solid state. Much more reliable. I have a mate who had it done and really likes it. From the outside everything looks original.

I'll dig out some examples of the later system when I get a chance.

Cheers,
Phillip

[nth]

Thanks Phillip
The SLC-2 is present and working. I have full lighting including flashing indicators recently installed with ild lucas dash switch.
Might look at that harness to tidy things uo.
I think thee dynamo will need doing - there is a local place near to me - Wood Auto that use to do this. Had also considered a dynamator but maybe a step too far! Who did you have in mind?
A bit of wing detail when still in Newtonards NI
Cheers
Neil

[Phillip]

Hey Neil,

Looks like it will be a nice car when finished! Interesting front wing profile.

This is mine:

Phillip_1934 Singer Nine Sports_Gazette.jpg (398 KiB) Viewed 3246 times

The guy who does the dynamo / cutout conversions is here:

http://www.dynamoregulatorconversions.com

He's always at Beaulieu. Also sells a lot of lamps conversions, etc. Not cheap, but very good quality.

Hope that helps!

[nth]

Great. Thanks very much.
Nice car you have.
Think mine will end up ivory over signal red as upholstery needs doing.
Front wing on mine seems rather cut away under front. My guess is after market spar from '60s

[Phillip]

Thanks Neil! It's very original and was stored for over 50 years.

Full story is here:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=669

CORRECTION: I realise also that I miss-typed the early dynamo type used in '33: It should read in full: E418 AL / 0 BP 0 . Apologies to those following the thread! "BP" is part of the Lucas - CAV - Rotax numbering system relating to components used on Singer cars. If you see these referenced on your components then they were meant for a Singer.

The dynamo you should have is the 1934 replacement for the E418 and this should be the C45A /2 BP / 0

[fongers]

Are there different oil throwers used ?
My newly aquired oil thrower is to high and has a bigger radius then the front cap. Any sugestions?]

[Phillip]

Hi Roel,

I have a few dynamo assemblies - both early and late - so I will check and see if there are any variations. Did you get the new one from Hardwick Spares or have it made?

Cheers,
Phillip

[fongers]

Yes i got it from Hardwick
Thanks already, Philip

[nth]

The joining part appears to be brass or bronze

Hey Neil,

My pleasure to help!

Very useful shot! This is indeed the later type. Your dynamo drive is probably the type with the four tooth gears and rubber 'cushion' ring...but who knows what has been fitted after all these years. I am going to guess your car has the long front wings, not the 'helmet' type. The CGC is a nice extra and was also on my car when new, but, sadly has been lost in time. It's a '34 Sports also, registered in late '33 in the Isle of Wight.

If the wiring is dodgy you could always go for a new Autosparks harness that is the correct spec with 'cloth covered' (now rayon) wires in the correct Lucas colours, braided into the correct style loom. I don't see the junction box that is usually mounted on the upper/outer bolt of the dynamo flange. Do you still have the Lucas SLC-2 control switch at the bottom of the steering column?

There is a company in the UK that will rebuild your dynamo and match it to your cutout by converting the internals to proper two brush and the cutout to solid state. Much more reliable. I have a mate who had it done and really likes it. From the outside everything looks original.

I'll dig out some examples of the later system when I get a chance.

Cheers,
Phillip

[nth]

Incompetance|
The joining part between dynamo and distributor gear box seems to be brass or bronze