brake question

[mikeyr]

working on the brakes for my LM. The brake shoes have had lead poured into parts of the casting. I initially thought it was JB-Weld a epoxy putty and assumed the shoes were cracked but nope, they seem fine. The lead was not shaped and installed, it was melted and poured into the casting, I know that because its melted into the threads of the bolt and a perfect fit to all the various shapes.

Why would anyone do this kind of thing ? or is there a valid reason that I have not heard of ? My only thought it was added as dampening weight to prevent chatter or squeaking, but really seems odd. If there is a valid reason, then I will re-pour it in as one shoe is missing half that the other shoe has, so easier to melt some lead and re-pour.

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[jeans_old_man]

I have never heard of that before. It was probably done in the mistaken believe that the hollows in the shoes form trumpets that cause the squeel. In fact it is the steel drums that squeel. A band around the circumference is one solution. When it happened to me I just changed the brake linings with good results.

[Peter McKercher]

I've seen a lot of Singer brake shoes and never encountered this. For squeaking, as Brian says, a band around the drum does the trick. Mine squeaked like crazy when cold until I added bands that I found on a spare set of drums.

[nth]

Hi Peter
Something I've never seen before and I've been messing with cars for well over 50 years! It's an obvious (when you know) solution. Does anyone still make them?
What is the material in contact with the drum??
Might have to commission some as my nine howls at time!
Cheers
Neil

[Peter McKercher]

I've had a couple of spare sets of drums kicking around for years and they both had different versions of the same thing. I didn't clue in until I took the drums from my Le Mans to a machine shop to have a mil or two shaved off where they were rubbing on the backing plate. The machinist put a large rubber band around them to keep them from squealing as he milled them.

I removed one set of bands from the spare drums which used asbestos as the padding, cleaned them up and cut some strips of hydro silica gasket material to replace the asbestos.

[nth]

Thanks Peter
Funily enough I just shimmed one drum out 25 thou to stop rubbing last week!
I'll try a pair of jubilee bands and gasketing.
Cheers
Neil

[mikeyr]

So I took out all the lead on the 4 brake shoes, only the rear shoes had lead in them. Glass beaded them and I see no damage at all, I was afraid that was a crack repair but nope it does not appear to be. Going to powder coat them later this week when I do a bunch of parts and then rivet on the new pad. Never done that before, thinking I should buy a riveting jig, they are only $35 but since you have to hammer the rivets anyway, can't I just use a punch ? Luckily I am installing finned brake drums so that should take care of any squeaks, squeals and other noises as they won't vibrate like regular drums, yeah, they can still be noisy but less likely.

Next is steering gear and that takes care of all the major sub-assemblies. By the time winter shows up (hey we do get 2 sometimes even 3 days of rain in So. Calif.) and it cools down to mid-50's F (low 10's C) I can be in the garage assembling.

[Peter McKercher]

Good to see you're finally getting the lead out on your restoration.

[mikeyr]

nice soft lead too, good to make bullets for black powder toys.

Getting all the items off the wife's honey do list but also working on car.

[telco.2]

Just to assure you...the finned drums are a huge improvement to the brakes ...and no squeaks or squeals in either direction of rotation!!
Bill

[mikeyr]

Ok, so I took all the lead pieces off of all the parts, no cracks or obvious damage, no idea why it was put on.

But the brake spring stud, has a nut on the backside and the lead gave the nut a nice place to sit. The nut interferes with the casting and won't go all the way down. Was there something there to allow the nut to tighten, something like a short piece of steel spacer ? or what ? I have 2 options, I can mill out some space for the nut, but I don't like that idea. Or chuck up some steel rod in the lathe and make something about 1/2" long to allow the nut to tighten up. I looked around the Hardwick site, no pics or drawings to help me.

Also, it looks like at one time someone experimented with drilling new rivet locations, not sure why, but there are extra holes for rivets. At least my pads fit some existing holes.

[Peter McKercher]

Perhaps the nut has been replaced with a larger one. It should fit within the recess.

[mikeyr]

If it was, it was done on all 4

Thanks for the pics I am on right track

Good idea though I will find a smaller diameter nut

Ok WTF STEEL RIVETS to hold the brake pad to the shoe ?

One of my front wheel brakes (don’t know left or right and it does not matter now) used steel rivets. No wonder that drum was destroyed when the pad got worn. The others were brass. This car fights me every step because of course they drilled the holes oversized for the steel rivets.

I will fix it but geez

[Peter McKercher]

Mine fought me to the last nut. The only thing that went without a hitch was the gas line. From the petrol tank tap to all the unions, nothing leaked first try.

[jeans_old_man]

I am lucky to have a local firm who specialise in relining brakes and clutches - Saftek at Cleckheaton, West Yorkshire. They don't use rivets but bond the linings to the shoes: