Web Forum for Singer Cars

My 1952 4AD developed a leak in the water pump. I posted a request on the bulletin board for a source for a mechanical seal with no response. I did some checking on my own with a local industrial seal supplier. They came up with a U.S Seal, part # PS-142 that fits and works fine. Just passing this along in case it might help someone else. This seal requires no machining of the impeller as some other substitute seals do.

Regards,
Mark Thompson

Great news, the water pump is one of the little items (but really important) that we don't have a lot of info on for this car.

I will be needing one of those seals in a few months myself.

Dave
Do we have this on the interchange list?

Mark,

Great research! You are the clever one. Yet another great use of the club resources (the net) to help out new (and not so new) members with valuable info.

Paul

Paul,
Thanks for the kind words. I never would have been able to complete my restoration without the contributions of all our fellow enthusiasts at NASOC. Glad to be of help. By the way the seal only cost about $15. A few years back, I purchased a spare seal from Trevor Cornelius , but that seal was oversized by about 1/16 inch in diameter. It worked but it required machining the impeller. My current project, the 1953 4ADT has not been machined. So now I have to keep spares for both sizes.

My water pump housing needed the face lapped to mate with the mechanical seal. Since the surface is recessed there is a problem getting to it with conventional lapping techniques. I successfully used a discarded engine valve to lap the surface.
I chucked the valve in my drill press, set the speed to the slowest, and used valve lapping compound. You need to be sure the drill press table is square to the spindle. It didn't take long at all to get the surface back smooth enough to seal.

Best Regards,
Mark Thompson

Hi Mark .. reading with interest your message on the water pump seal ..
I have purchased a US SEAL PS-142 to replace my water pump seal and is very tight when installed..this seal came in 2 sections and is considerably higher than the original seal I took out of the water pump which is in one part.
I have tried to upload some photos so you can compare them, but not sure if they will work out,..
The question is ... was your water pump tight when you installed the PS-142 seal, and did you use both parts of the seal


[img=http://s6.postimg.org/reo5hovtp/002.jpg]

[img=http://s6.postimg.org/bizbee599/003.jpg]

[img=http://s6.postimg.org/xtn6ed2jh/004.jpg]

Regards
Stephen

!!!! Added the images to the post, Mike

Hello Stephen,
Yes, it is a snug fit that requires pressing in. You shouldn't have to use great force to get it to go in though. If you are having a problem you might try leaving the seal in the freezer for a couple of hours before pressing in. As I recall the second part is a ceramic face that is used on another model pump and is not used in the Singer water pump.
Hope this helps.

Best Regards, Mark Thompson

Hi Mark .. Thank you for your fast response ..
I had both parts of the seal in the pump, because that's how it came in the box and I thought it was the correct way to assemble, but the impeller would not turn when assembled, I will now remove the extra ceramic part .
Once again thank you for your help..
Regards
Stephen

Glad to help. Be sure to examine the water pump housing for a smooth mating surface for the seal. See the note above about resurfacing the pump housing if needed. Good luck.

Best Reagrds,
Mark Thompson

hi
sorry to hi jack this thread.

i need assistance

i took my pump from my 1952 nine apart to day.
no seals at all!

the above thread mentioned seals, how big is it.
i found a repair kit with one axel and two seals !

do i need one or two ? i have no exploded wiew of the pump. there seems to very little room for it in my housing.
i made a pichture to show the type.
i found the PS142 seal in UK, will that work with my pump ?

greethings from
klaus
denmark

just to clarify,
same pichture twice, i am not shure on how to delete one of them, sorry,
klaus

!!!! Fixed it, removed one pic. Mike

and link to rep set:
javascript:popupWindow('http://geros1968.com/index.php?main_pag ... ge&pID=946')
klaus

try this link:
http://geros1968.com/index.php?main_pag ... ge&pID=946

!!!! Added the image, Mike

Hi Klaus,

That is correct, there are no seals near the bearings, just the thread on the axle (called oil retainer in the picture below). The water seal is between the impeller and the bearing housing shown in your pictures. Below is a cross sectional view from the pump, taken from the SM1500 Technical Service Manual. The seal is the part C. It is a spring loaded graphite ring that seats against a flat surface on the inner end of the bearing housing. The seal shown in the link you posted looks correct, at least it is of correct type.
Best Regards,
Pekka

thank you Pekka,
a drawing explains it very well.
i ordered the gland/seal i found in UK.
thank you again.

ps
would it be nice if we al collected drawings , partsl list, alternative spares a.s.o.
on these pages ?
klaus