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rebuilding two 4A's

Posted: Mon Dec 25, 2017 7:16 pm
by tvdwerf
It is always the same, try to rebuild a car without a drawing without information, and without all the parts...

Re: rebuilding two 4A's

Posted: Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:11 pm
by tvdwerf
By removing the old wood, I see copper and steel screws, what should it be original?

Re: rebuilding two 4A's

Posted: Tue Jan 02, 2018 3:18 pm
by fly4ad
When restoring my 1952 4AD, all wood fasteners were steel. I found no brass or any other type material. Unfortunately, most local hardware stores seem to not carry slotted wood screws these days. As with all the proper Singer hardware, your patience will be tested as you wait for that special order package of hardware to arrive in the mail, only to find out that you need more! Keep up the good work, you're well on your way! :P

Re: rebuilding two 4A's

Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 6:03 pm
by Phillip
I agree with Fred for sure...Singer used mild steel fasteners and I note from your bucket of screws that you also have the original carriage bolts with square nuts, an interesting feature that lingered on from pre-war production, where they featured more prominently.

As Fred says, slotted screws are getting hard to find and I usually replace all 'captive' ones (those on the wood frame that you can't get at after assembly) with stainless steel. Anyone who has tackled a Roadster wood frame knows the mess those old steel screws make!

Good luck with your restoration!

Re: rebuilding two 4A's

Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 9:33 pm
by tvdwerf
I already found a small trick to get a rusted old screw out,
take a cheap new screw and a mig welder.
One short pulse to connect them and turn it out ;)

The biggest question now is the difference between the two, one of the steering columns has a metal strip with 2 holes under the dash, above the pedals, but I don't know if this has a function, or is original.
The other one does not have him.
What could be the function, and what part is missing to connect him ?

Re: rebuilding two 4A's

Posted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 10:52 pm
by Phillip
I've restored a couple of 4A's and a couple of A Series Roadsters over the years and I can tell you that the welded bracket is not original and would prevent the column from being adjustable for height, as it originally was.

The upper steering column bracket is bolted to the upper face of the firewall bulkhead. This photo is of a pre-war version, but it is virtually the same design from the early thirties to the introduction of the 4AD. The main difference was a change to steel from brass for the castings.

Steering column bracket.jpg
Steering column bracket.jpg (125.43 KiB) Viewed 95 times

Two half-castings wrap the steering column tube and clamp it in place (not shown in the photo) held together by two cross bolts, one of which also holds the pivot arms shown in the photo.

When the pinch bolt is slackened off on the steering box support bracket down on the frame, the half casting around the column can slide up and down the column to raise or lower the height, restricted by the length of the pivot arms and the cutout in the dashboard.

Hope that Helps!

Re: rebuilding two 4A's

Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 9:44 am
by tvdwerf
Good to know, in that case the one without the bracket is original.
Maybe the previous owner had put him there because of a rotten front, to give more strength..
I do not remove him now, you don't see him when all is on his place.
The other one is also there, and already mounted on his place.

Re: rebuilding two 4A's

Posted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 9:05 pm
by tvdwerf
When cleaning the metal parts, inside the engine bay, and the front wings, I found this grey colour.
On other cars inside is black, but I have also a car who is inside and outside green...
The grey layer looks like original, from the factory, or am I wrong?

Re: rebuilding two 4A's

Posted: Sun Jan 07, 2018 10:30 pm
by Phillip
A very tough and hard grey primer was used by Singer and perhaps this is what the remnants are .

My '46 A series had never been restored and there was black paint on the scuttle inner side panels and body colour paint on the inside and outside of the wings. The inner wings looked almost primer colour!

Re: rebuilding two 4A's

Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 10:30 am
by tvdwerf
Yesterday the first primer on the wings, at the company we were spraying a lot machine parts, and the wings could be done together ;)
So when I am finished, and the wing should be in the body colour, inside near the chassis and engine, and the dirty side, all body colour?
That means easy painting, just like yesterday, hanging on a special frame for painting parts in the painting cabin, and not in my barn with to much dust, and not enough light...